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	<title>Comments on: RIP Rehnquist</title>
	<link>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/</link>
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	<pubDate>Wed, 07 Jan 2009 23:23:39 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Hispanic Pundit &#187; Why Rehnquist Was Good For Minorities</title>
		<link>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-66348</link>
		<dc:creator>Hispanic Pundit &#187; Why Rehnquist Was Good For Minorities</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Sep 2005 07:47:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-66348</guid>
		<description>[...] A few days ago I posted a RIP post in remembrance of Rehnquist and his importance on the Supreme Court. That post than initiated a response from my liberal latino friend Nebur that originally started out in the comments section and eventually spilled over into his blog, here and here, and the comments section there. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] A few days ago I posted a RIP post in remembrance of Rehnquist and his importance on the Supreme Court. That post than initiated a response from my liberal latino friend Nebur that originally started out in the comments section and eventually spilled over into his blog, here and here, and the comments section there. [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: HispanicPundit</title>
		<link>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-65269</link>
		<dc:creator>HispanicPundit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Sep 2005 00:55:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-65269</guid>
		<description>Good stuff Nebur, I'll respond in a bit.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good stuff Nebur, I&#8217;ll respond in a bit.</p>
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		<title>By: nebur</title>
		<link>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-65236</link>
		<dc:creator>nebur</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Sep 2005 18:51:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-65236</guid>
		<description>So I got longwinded in my response.  Here it is: http://nebursworld.blogspot.com/2005/09/rehnquist-was-racist-part-ii.html</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So I got longwinded in my response.  Here it is: <a href="http://nebursworld.blogspot.com/2005/09/rehnquist-was-racist-part-ii.html" rel="nofollow">http://nebursworld.blogspot.com/2005/09/rehnquist-was-racist-part-ii.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: HispanicPundit</title>
		<link>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-64726</link>
		<dc:creator>HispanicPundit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Sep 2005 05:36:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-64726</guid>
		<description>Hey Nebur, my latino liberal friend,

I find it ironic that you first start off your response defending the 'rights of the minority', the 'rights of those who had no say in the legal justice system' against those who wish to 'impose their will on the minority'. It was so well written, so well thought out, that I was right there smiling at everything you say. 

Than, you get to abortion and write, "&lt;i&gt;However, Roe placed the choice directly in the hands of women. There’s no greater example of self-government than a woman’s right to govern her own body"&lt;/i&gt;. The irony comes in the fact that you argue against the very thing you argued for in the above paragraphs. How would someone saying, "However, Dred Scott placed the choice directly in the hands of citizens. There’s no greater example of self-government than a citizens’s right to govern their own property" be any different than yours? In other words, in both cases you are a priori assuming that the persons in question, blacks and unborn children, are not persons, and than reasoning from there. You are, in effect, arguing in favor of the 'majority trampling on the rights of the minority', of 'imposing ones will on another', and all of the stuff you argued against above. But back to our point... 

As you probably have already guessed, I am strongly pro-life. There are few things in my political make up that I believe in as strongly as my pro-life views, &lt;i&gt;yet&lt;/i&gt; I would still prefer a states right Supreme Court verdict with regard to abortion as opposed to a federalized 'living constituion' &lt;i&gt;federal ban&lt;/i&gt; on abortion (although I would support a constitutional ammendment that bans abortion, precisely because it is still done democratically). Why? Precisely because I believe that moral issues, whether one agrees with the specific moral issue or not, are better settled through &lt;i&gt;democratic&lt;/i&gt; means, than through forced federalism. So just because someone believes in states rights on an issue, does not necessarily mean that one is against that specific issue. 

So for you to prove that Rehnquist was a biggot, the onus is on you to show that he was &lt;em&gt;conveniently&lt;/em&gt; a states right person. In other words, that he voted for states rights on certain issues (say with segregation issues) and not on other issues.  But that is something you cannot do, since Rehnquist was &lt;em&gt;consistently&lt;/em&gt; pro-states rights, not just with segregation, but with &lt;em&gt;all&lt;/em&gt;(or even just most) issues of his time, most notably Roe vs. Wade (He ruled against it, and in doing so, voted in favor of states deciding for themselves). 

So since he was consistently states rights, one should judge him based on &lt;em&gt;that&lt;/em&gt; principle, not on individual cases, and on &lt;em&gt;that principle&lt;/em&gt; I tend to agree with him, while disagreeing with him on the particular instance of segragation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Nebur, my latino liberal friend,</p>
<p>I find it ironic that you first start off your response defending the &#8216;rights of the minority&#8217;, the &#8216;rights of those who had no say in the legal justice system&#8217; against those who wish to &#8216;impose their will on the minority&#8217;. It was so well written, so well thought out, that I was right there smiling at everything you say. </p>
<p>Than, you get to abortion and write, &#8220;<i>However, Roe placed the choice directly in the hands of women. There’s no greater example of self-government than a woman’s right to govern her own body&#8221;</i>. The irony comes in the fact that you argue against the very thing you argued for in the above paragraphs. How would someone saying, &#8220;However, Dred Scott placed the choice directly in the hands of citizens. There’s no greater example of self-government than a citizens’s right to govern their own property&#8221; be any different than yours? In other words, in both cases you are a priori assuming that the persons in question, blacks and unborn children, are not persons, and than reasoning from there. You are, in effect, arguing in favor of the &#8216;majority trampling on the rights of the minority&#8217;, of &#8216;imposing ones will on another&#8217;, and all of the stuff you argued against above. But back to our point&#8230; </p>
<p>As you probably have already guessed, I am strongly pro-life. There are few things in my political make up that I believe in as strongly as my pro-life views, <i>yet</i> I would still prefer a states right Supreme Court verdict with regard to abortion as opposed to a federalized &#8216;living constituion&#8217; <i>federal ban</i> on abortion (although I would support a constitutional ammendment that bans abortion, precisely because it is still done democratically). Why? Precisely because I believe that moral issues, whether one agrees with the specific moral issue or not, are better settled through <i>democratic</i> means, than through forced federalism. So just because someone believes in states rights on an issue, does not necessarily mean that one is against that specific issue. </p>
<p>So for you to prove that Rehnquist was a biggot, the onus is on you to show that he was <em>conveniently</em> a states right person. In other words, that he voted for states rights on certain issues (say with segregation issues) and not on other issues.  But that is something you cannot do, since Rehnquist was <em>consistently</em> pro-states rights, not just with segregation, but with <em>all</em>(or even just most) issues of his time, most notably Roe vs. Wade (He ruled against it, and in doing so, voted in favor of states deciding for themselves). </p>
<p>So since he was consistently states rights, one should judge him based on <em>that</em> principle, not on individual cases, and on <em>that principle</em> I tend to agree with him, while disagreeing with him on the particular instance of segragation.</p>
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		<title>By: nebur</title>
		<link>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-64703</link>
		<dc:creator>nebur</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Sep 2005 04:26:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-64703</guid>
		<description>My Hispanic Friend,

First of all, as a lawyer, I know that any principle, constitutional or otherwise, can be bastardized to achieve any purpose.  Example: It sounds real nice and democratic to promote federalism and say that the people (and not a centralized power) should "decide their own fates,"  until we stop and think that a great many of those people are simply trying to breath, their necks gasping under the oppressive boot of the the dominant class.  Federalism is a crock of manure.  Bigotry is wrong; institutionalized bigotry is unconscionable.   The showdown in Little Rock was proof that the South would not have changed its ways had the Supreme Court not stepped in.

Second, Brown v. Board did not fail us, rather government and lawyers sabotaged the implementation of Brown.  And coincidentally, Mr. Chief Justice Rehnquist was a chief player in the anti-Brown efforts.  As a lawyer, he fought to keep blacks and hispanics from voting. He fought to keep the federal government from enforcing Brown.  He fought to keep his home (with a racially-exclusive covenant) free from those pesky blacks and hispanics and jews.

Third of all, you argue that the Supreme court's decision on the abortion issue "took away the citizen's right to decide the issue for themselves."  Logical fallacy, my good friend.  Logical fallacy.  You argument, unless I am mistaken, runs as follows:  People should be able to decide issues for themselves, ergo, when the Supreme Court took away the right of the State's to decide the issue, it somehow took away the people's choice.  However, Roe placed the choice directly in the hands of women.  There's no greater example of self-government than a woman's right to govern her own body.

Rehnquist was a biggot. So was Robert Byrd.  Unlike Byrd, W.R. never disavowed himself of his racist past.  For my eulogy to the Chief Justice, I paraphrase a line from Fiddler on the Roof.  The irony is not lost on me, given that W.R. was also a raving anti-semite:

"May God bless and keep Rehnquist...... Far away from me!"</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My Hispanic Friend,</p>
<p>First of all, as a lawyer, I know that any principle, constitutional or otherwise, can be bastardized to achieve any purpose.  Example: It sounds real nice and democratic to promote federalism and say that the people (and not a centralized power) should &#8220;decide their own fates,&#8221;  until we stop and think that a great many of those people are simply trying to breath, their necks gasping under the oppressive boot of the the dominant class.  Federalism is a crock of manure.  Bigotry is wrong; institutionalized bigotry is unconscionable.   The showdown in Little Rock was proof that the South would not have changed its ways had the Supreme Court not stepped in.</p>
<p>Second, Brown v. Board did not fail us, rather government and lawyers sabotaged the implementation of Brown.  And coincidentally, Mr. Chief Justice Rehnquist was a chief player in the anti-Brown efforts.  As a lawyer, he fought to keep blacks and hispanics from voting. He fought to keep the federal government from enforcing Brown.  He fought to keep his home (with a racially-exclusive covenant) free from those pesky blacks and hispanics and jews.</p>
<p>Third of all, you argue that the Supreme court&#8217;s decision on the abortion issue &#8220;took away the citizen&#8217;s right to decide the issue for themselves.&#8221;  Logical fallacy, my good friend.  Logical fallacy.  You argument, unless I am mistaken, runs as follows:  People should be able to decide issues for themselves, ergo, when the Supreme Court took away the right of the State&#8217;s to decide the issue, it somehow took away the people&#8217;s choice.  However, Roe placed the choice directly in the hands of women.  There&#8217;s no greater example of self-government than a woman&#8217;s right to govern her own body.</p>
<p>Rehnquist was a biggot. So was Robert Byrd.  Unlike Byrd, W.R. never disavowed himself of his racist past.  For my eulogy to the Chief Justice, I paraphrase a line from Fiddler on the Roof.  The irony is not lost on me, given that W.R. was also a raving anti-semite:</p>
<p>&#8220;May God bless and keep Rehnquist&#8230;&#8230; Far away from me!&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: HispanicPundit</title>
		<link>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-64660</link>
		<dc:creator>HispanicPundit</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Sep 2005 01:09:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-64660</guid>
		<description>While I personally would have been against Rehnquist on his segregation stance, I don't see it quite as black and white as you do. 

There &lt;i&gt;is&lt;/i&gt; something to be said in support of federalism as a general principle. There &lt;i&gt;is&lt;/i&gt; something to be said in  allowing society as a whole to settle their contentious issues, through democratic means,  instead of having it forced down their throats by some centralized power. Liberals understand this clearly with their arguments against a constitutional ban on gay marriage, but they seem to lose sight of it on other issues. Just look at, for example, what federalizing abortion has done to that topic, a lot of the reason abortion is such a divisive issue today is &lt;em&gt;because&lt;/em&gt; the Supreme Court took away the citizens right to decide the issue for themselves. 

In addition to allowing citizens decide their own fates for themselves, it must also be remembered that federal legislation itself is very &lt;em&gt;very&lt;/em&gt; limited in its results. Just look at Brown vs. Board of education, many people thought, at the time, that its ruling was the  panacea, yet the results fifty plus years later clearly show that Brown vs Board of education did little, if anything at all, to help the situation (Sowell has a great three part series on the aftermath of Brown 50 years later, &lt;a href="http://www.townhall.com/columnists/thomassowell/ts20040512.shtml" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;a href="http://www.townhall.com/columnists/thomassowell/ts20040513.shtml" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;, and &lt;a href="http://www.townhall.com/columnists/thomassowell/ts20040514.shtml" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;).

So while I do agree that Rehnquist was wrong on this particular point, I don't see it as quite the failure you do.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While I personally would have been against Rehnquist on his segregation stance, I don&#8217;t see it quite as black and white as you do. </p>
<p>There <i>is</i> something to be said in support of federalism as a general principle. There <i>is</i> something to be said in  allowing society as a whole to settle their contentious issues, through democratic means,  instead of having it forced down their throats by some centralized power. Liberals understand this clearly with their arguments against a constitutional ban on gay marriage, but they seem to lose sight of it on other issues. Just look at, for example, what federalizing abortion has done to that topic, a lot of the reason abortion is such a divisive issue today is <em>because</em> the Supreme Court took away the citizens right to decide the issue for themselves. </p>
<p>In addition to allowing citizens decide their own fates for themselves, it must also be remembered that federal legislation itself is very <em>very</em> limited in its results. Just look at Brown vs. Board of education, many people thought, at the time, that its ruling was the  panacea, yet the results fifty plus years later clearly show that Brown vs Board of education did little, if anything at all, to help the situation (Sowell has a great three part series on the aftermath of Brown 50 years later, <a href="http://www.townhall.com/columnists/thomassowell/ts20040512.shtml" rel="nofollow">here</a>, <a href="http://www.townhall.com/columnists/thomassowell/ts20040513.shtml" rel="nofollow">here</a>, and <a href="http://www.townhall.com/columnists/thomassowell/ts20040514.shtml" rel="nofollow">here</a>).</p>
<p>So while I do agree that Rehnquist was wrong on this particular point, I don&#8217;t see it as quite the failure you do.</p>
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		<title>By: nebur</title>
		<link>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-64659</link>
		<dc:creator>nebur</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Sep 2005 00:35:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://hispanicpundit.com/2005/09/05/rip-rehnquist/#comment-64659</guid>
		<description>May he rest in peace.  He faithfully served his country for decades.  

This being said, I believe that our country is worse off because of his tenure.  He was an avowed segregationist  and, like so many of his great white fathers, veiled his views in constitutional phrases like federalism and reserved powers.

No one who argued the constitutionality of Plessey v. Fergusson (in the 1950's lo less) should ever have become a supreme court justice.  If it were up to him, i would have been educated in a run-down schoolhouse with no books and a whole lot of dark faces.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>May he rest in peace.  He faithfully served his country for decades.  </p>
<p>This being said, I believe that our country is worse off because of his tenure.  He was an avowed segregationist  and, like so many of his great white fathers, veiled his views in constitutional phrases like federalism and reserved powers.</p>
<p>No one who argued the constitutionality of Plessey v. Fergusson (in the 1950&#8217;s lo less) should ever have become a supreme court justice.  If it were up to him, i would have been educated in a run-down schoolhouse with no books and a whole lot of dark faces.</p>
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